In a significant development, former pro-Trump attorney turned co-defendant, Kenneth Chesebro, has divulged fresh insights into then-President Donald Trump’s post-2020 election meetings with a series of lawyers. CNN exclusively obtained tapes containing Chesebro’s revelations. Chesebro, who had previously pleaded guilty to charges related to the Georgia election crimes case, is now cooperating with investigations in Michigan and Wisconsin, particularly regarding the fake electors plot.
During an appearance on CNN’s “The Lead,” reporter Marshall Cohen played the tapes and shed light on their significance. Chesebro detailed an Oval Office meeting in December 2020, describing it as a “photo op gone wrong.” At that time, Trump’s legal team in Wisconsin had just suffered a setback in their election challenge. Lawyers were cautioned before meeting Trump not to provide false hope or entertain election-related conspiracies. Despite this warning, Chesebro revealed that lead attorney Jim Troupis personally conveyed to Trump that there was “zero hope for Wisconsin,” emphasizing a conscious effort to guide him toward conceding or abandoning the contested challenge.
Cohen highlighted the contradiction within Trump’s inner circle, where some advisers advised him against pursuing the election overturn, a crucial element in Special Counsel Jack Smith’s criminal case. While the Oval Office meeting wasn’t explicitly mentioned in the indictment, it amplifies existing evidence against Trump.
Additionally, Cohen pointed out an aspect of the audio that could potentially aid Trump’s defense. Chesebro, against the initial advice, brought up the possibility of contesting Arizona, explaining the hypothetical viability due to alternate electors. This revelation prompted a strong reaction from Reince Priebus, the former RNC chairman and White House Chief of Staff, who was present during the meeting. Chesebro noted that Priebus was “extremely concerned” about the information shared regarding Arizona and the perceived deadline of January 6. The revelation suggested internal divisions and conflicting messages within Trump’s circle, contributing to the tumultuous events leading up to the Capitol insurrection.
JAKE TAPPER, CNN HOST: So, Marshall, we’re talking about Kenneth Chesebro, the Wisconsin attorney, what happened in his interview with prosecutors and in the Oval Office?
MARSHALL COHEN: Well, he told prosecutors about what he called a photo op gone wrong. In the Oval Office in December 2020, go back to that hectic time. At that moment, Trump’s team in Wisconsin had just lost their election challenge. And the lawyers who led that case were in D.C. for a meet and greet with their client. Before they walked into the Oval Office, they were told, do not give him false hope, do not indulge the conspiracies about the election.
Some of them listened. Some of them didn’t. Here is a clip from Ken Chesebro describing what the lead attorney in Wisconsin, Jim Troupis, told Donald Trump.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
KENNETH CHESEBRO: It’s clear that Troupis personally told the president there was zero hope for Wisconsin. As part of this message, I think, crafted to try to get him to concede or just you know, give up this long shot challenge. So, there was a conscious effort to deflect him from a sense of any possibility that he could pull out the election.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COHEN: Zero hope. That’s what he said. So, look, some people around Trump told him that he couldn’t win. And he went on tried to overturn the election anyway. That’s a huge part of Special Counsel Jack Smith’s criminal case. That indictment is filled to the brim with examples of Trump being told by advisers and lawyers that he lost. This Oval Office meeting was not in the indictment, so it builds on the existing case, the existing evidence against Trump.
TAPPER: And you also say that another part of the audio reveals something that could possibly help Donald Trump’s defense. Tell us about that.
COHEN: Yes, that’s when Chesebro started talking in the meeting with Donald Trump. Again, remember, he was told don’t give trump any hope. Once the conversation moved to Arizona, he did just that. Take a listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CHESEBRO: So, I ended up explaining that Arizona was still hypothetically possible, because the alternate electors voted. And I explained the whole logic. Because the alternate electors had voted, we had more time to win the litigation. So, it was, I think, clear in a way that maybe hadn’t been before that we had till January 6 to win.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COHEN: So, he brought up January 6, brought up the fake electors. He told Trump that there was still a viable path to keep contesting the election. This was immediately met with fallout, Reince Priebus who helped arrange the meeting because of his Wisconsin connections in the White House.
TAPPER: Former RNC chairman and the former White House Chief of Staff, yes.
COHEN: Exactly. He helped arrange the meeting. He was in the room. He was livid. Listen to Chesebro describing Priebus’s reaction
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CHESEBRO: Right after the meeting, Troupis said that Reince Priebus was extremely concerned with what I told the president about Arizona and about the real deadline be January 6, and that he was going to do damage control, Reince was going to follow up. And, I mean, I was trying to mitigate whatever optimist I guess I created.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COHEN: So, some people told Trump he lost. Some people told Trump he could keep fighting. We all know which path he chose, which of course, ended with the insurrection here in Washington.
TAPPER: Yes, also ended up with Kenneth Chesebro getting indicted.
COHEN: And Trump.
TAPPER: And Donald Trump.
The tapes, obtained by CNN, add another layer to the unfolding narrative surrounding Trump’s post-election activities and legal challenges, implicating key individuals in the complex aftermath of the 2020 election.
