Former Congresswoman Rep. Liz Cheney (R-WY) revealed on MSNBC’s The Rachel Maddow Show that she rushed to the Capitol after an alarming January 4, 2021, call from the Trump White House. During this call, Trump lawyers briefed surrogates, including Cheney, about their plans for January 6, when Congress was set to certify the Electoral College results.
Cheney disclosed that she listened in on the call where Trump lawyer Jenna Ellis outlined a scenario in which Vice President Mike Pence could either refuse to open or refuse to count the electoral votes during the joint session on January 6. Cheney noted that while she had heard discussions about having alternative electors meet, the details became clear during this call.
Realizing the gravity of the situation, Cheney immediately ran to the Capitol and sought advice from the House parliamentarian about how to address the planned disruption during the joint session. She expressed deep concern about the use of fake electors and the anticipation that Pence might refuse to count legitimate electors.
Cheney explained that there were not many legislative steps available during a joint session, making it a dangerous and chilling moment. Despite the lack of clear solutions, Cheney commended Vice President Pence for ultimately performing his duty bravely. The revelation sheds light on the intense behind-the-scenes discussions and concerns leading up to the events of January 6, 2021, when a mob stormed the U.S. Capitol in an attempt to overturn the election results.
MADDOW: Let me ask you about a moment in your book that happened on January 4th. That’s described in chapter nine of your book. And you describe listening in on a call in which Trump lawyers are briefing what we call surrogates. That’s basically people that are going to go on TV and talk about the pro-Trump side of things.
CHENEY: Yeah.
MADDOW: And on that call law — Trump lawyer Jenna Ellis describes what they’re envisioning for January 6th. She says — the way you write it is — in the scenario Ellis described, when Pence was presiding, he could either refuse to open or refuse to count the electoral votes.
They don’t necessarily know you’re on this call. You’re listening in —
CHENEY: Right.
MADDOW: — just two days before January 6th.
Was that the moment when it really became clear to you in detail what they were going to try to do?
CHENEY: Yes. You know, I had heard. Obviously, there had been talk about we’re going to have these electors meet. I think Stephen Miller had been talking about that.
But it wasn’t clear to me what the contours of this particular part of the plan were until I dialed into that phone call. And listening to them describe how these fake electors were going to be used and the fact that they anticipated that Vice President Pence was going to use them to refuse to count the legitimate electors was certainly a moment of — of intense concern.
And as I got off that call, I ran into the Capitol, into the office of the parliamentarian of the House to say, you know, wait a minute, this is what I’m hearing is going to happen. What do we do about it in the joint session? How do we stop this?
And it was very clear that there were not a lot of good answers to that because I knew — I learned later through the investigation that Vice President Pence and his counsel were having discussions with the Senate parliamentarian and that the vice president, you know, ultimately, of course, did his duty bravely.
MADDOW: Uh-huh.
CHENEY: But if you’re in a joint session of Congress, you know, you’re not in a position where there are a lot of legislative steps that you can take except to basically move to adjourn. So it was a very dangerous and chilling moment.
